Emmy-Nominated Designer Kameron Lennox Talks About Actor Collaboration in Costume Creation

0:07 Welcome to Look Behind the Look, the celebrated podcast that explores your favorite looks in film, television, and fashion history. Through conversations with the fashion world's elite and award-winning hair, makeup, and costume designers on sets around the world, you will see and hear exciting tales from behind the scenes, career origin stories, and tons of advice and tips. I'm your host, Tiffany Bartok. Hey, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Look Behind the Look. It is Emmy season, and the voting is open. So I'm bringing you another episode about the studio because it's my obsession. It's amazing. You guys all know it's very inside baseball, but in a very fun way.

0:49 If you're not watching, what are you even doing? Which I love to say about most things that I talk about on the show, but this in particular is like... I love it. And you do too. So I'm talking to Cameron Lennox today. She is the costume designer for the show. And as you know, her work is just phenomenal in this show. She really brought this like old Hollywood glamour, but like in this insane, quirky. It's so good and so reflective of everybody's personality and just spot on for each character. So she's going to talk to me about how that all came to be and how she came up with some of the ideas that we get to enjoy watching in the costume design.

1:35 And I look forward to you enjoying the episode. That's it. Enjoy this conversation with Cameron. And don't forget to check out the one with Vanessa and Georgie about makeup. I'm going to attach it here in the show notes as well. So you can get totally geeked out on the studio and all the creative design. Hi, I'm here with Cameron Lennox from the studio. You are Emmy nominated for your costume design in this brilliant series, not limited series. It's going on. It's gotten renewed and I'm so thankful for it. But thanks for talking to me, Cameron.

2:15 I know how busy you are. Yeah, thank you. Thank you. Oh, yeah, absolutely. I've been so excited. This is absolutely, without a doubt, my favorite show this year, and it has replaced the bear temporarily, maybe. We don't know, but for sure. I've watched it twice. I'm watching it again with my son this time, and it's been a ride to watch it with him, I have to tell you. He has very specific questions for you. How old is your son? He's 16. Okay, good. He decided that he wants to be Matt, Seth Rogen's character now, which is a little scary. But I just have to ask you how you came to the project.

3:00 I've spoken to Vanessa Price and Georgie Douglas. I did watch that. Yeah. Cause you know, we're, we're all good friends. So she sent it to me right away and I watched it. It was really cute. I mean, it's really nice though. They're a little banter between each other too. Yeah. I always feel like, can we go out after this? Like, can we? Yeah, I know. I know. And they are a party. Sung your praises. Oh, I know. I heard about the hair hat and how Cammie loves a hat. And that is true. That is true. Yeah. Yes, yes, yes. So you two, I mean, you and Seth, tell me how you came to the project, just like I have not heard anything. Okay, yeah.

3:40 So, you know, it is interesting because it's not anything that I expected at all. You know, I randomly met Seth on Pam and Tommy because I work with Craig Gillespie and he brought me in on that project. project and um so that was the first time we worked together and literally in the fitting room for his character was the first time i had met him and um i just found him to be um such an interesting person um he definitely had his take on his characters but he didn't ever control what i had envisioned like you know like he had his his ideas and his opinions but he let me do what I do and laughed at it and saw the humor in it, you know, and took it and helped, you know, he molded it into his character and he used what we did on that project because he's not glamorous by any means in that show.

4:37 Right. And he was playing something so different than his normal character. So then I met him again, because I had worked with Rose Byrne before on an Apple TV show called Physical. And so she had recommended me for Platonic when it came around, season one. And so... There we were again, you know, on another project together and it was like, hey, remember me, you know, and and that character, too, has a very specific. All those characters have very specific, very different looks to them. Yeah. But they're unique and there's a lot to it. You know, it's not just, you know, khakis and a button shirt or something like that.

5:20 And so he started talking about that character. So that character, there's nowhere in those scripts that describe how he dressed. So he had said some things that he was thinking, and then we just ran with it, and it became what it was, right? And so then we worked again on Craig Gillespie's movie, Dumb Money. um I loved that movie I loved GameStop phenomenon yeah and there he was just even a totally different character so I'd already kind of you know established this relationship with him but it's it was so nice and uh well balanced he's a very balanced person to to talk to and work with and he's so open to things that um when we're on um on the studio, or no, on Platonica, I'd kind of heard rumblings that he had a show that he was going to do.

6:12 And so I got this call, Seth and Evan want to meet with you to discuss the show that they're doing for Apple. And, you know, in my mind's eye, I wasn't thinking like, oh, they're going to offer it to me. It was like, oh, this, you know, I want to do this. I love working with him. And I got the scripts and the scripts were, you know, like, Like right away, I was like, absolutely. And then we got on the Zoom and I thought I was just like doing my song and dance to convince them like I'm the person for you. And it was like the Zoom was all the producers, showrunners, everybody. And they just went right into talking about the... the show and you know it was different than a normal interview and so I had to stop them in the middle of it and just kind of ask like uh are you guys meeting with any other designers and that's when I learned like they were like no and so you know like it wasn't expected but it was like it felt so right you know like I already knew him I knew their vision and and I also have such a love for old Hollywood um I have a um you know, even for architecture and, you know, locations.

7:21 I grew up here. I'm a Southern California girl. My great-grandmother lived here during World War II and worked in the factories. And then my grandmother was a USO dancer with all the soldiers when they came back in the 1940s. And my mother was born here. So I just... And there's something about... just hollywood in itself that i just have really loved and when i was a teenager my friends and i would just go on missions to find like you know jane mansfield's pink castle or you know her big beautiful house with the heart-shaped gate and the heart-shaped pool or we would go find all these locations we had all these little like hollywood books or we would get the stars maps yep you know from the people even though we're from here we're like no i want to do this like i want to i want to see all of this and um And interesting enough, when they called to meet on this, I was listening to the Karina Longworth podcast.

8:22 No, there's, there's a couple. So it was, yeah, it's like, I think it's called Can You? You must remember this. You must remember this. Yeah. I always get it confused with the Muppet song. Can you picture this? Of course you do. Yeah. It's either the Muppets or, like, old Hollywood. Well, and you know that I refer to the studio as the adult Muppet show. Oh, yeah, I did see that. And then Vanessa's, like, breakdown of each character was so good. And accurate. Who's Animal? Oh, definitely Bryan Cranston. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I was listening to that. So when, when I got the scripts, I was like already in that headspace and, and we just started spitballing on it.

9:09 And then Julie Berghoff, who is our amazing production designer, sent me her deck and I started looking through, you know, how, what her, she was doing as far as the, you know, the architecture and all of that. And it was just like, okay. And it just, everything just kind of fell into place. Yeah. And then, you know, and then of course, Georgie and Vanessa, you know, I sent them the deck. They're just like, okay, okay. This is not what I was expecting. And, you know, we just, they just went with that, which was great. Cause it's like, and I feel like going into season two, like now we kind of know who these characters are and we can really even, you know, come together and discuss, but it was very collaborative.

9:51 Like everybody on that crew worked together and, um adam i feel like was the busiest rdp just because it's like it was from like the morning till you know like they were just figuring things out figuring things out oh my gosh it's just revolutionary it's absolutely incredible the energy and the music and the music is just another thing that really stands out it's choreographed so tightly um It's amazing. I've heard that this deck needs to be like published. It needs to be a coffee table book. I've heard that it's like glorious. Yeah, there's a few decks. Like I have my department's deck and then Julie has her deck. And then I know that Georgie and Vanessa had their things going.

10:35 Yeah, we should publish a book. It would be great to get Adam's deck. That one I don't... I mean, we had a lot of discussions about how it was going to be shot, but... Oh, did you? Well, okay. The first meeting, when they called me in for that meeting, where I thought I was, like, doing my song and dance, they definitely started talking about how they were going to film it. But the whole Warner thing kind of came later. Like, that really was, like... I mean, they... I knew that they were going to try things out. I mean, Seth and Evan, they're just ranting about how they wanted it to feel. Like when we were doing the films, I remember this in the conversation very clearly.

11:17 When we were doing our fictitious films, it was going to be shot in a way that you knew that it was a film, right? And then when we were shooting, they're using different cameras and handheld when it was the day-to-day to show the chaos behind making these very polished, beautiful films. They wanted to show that because that's really how it feels when you're running against the clock and trying to figure out all these things that need to happen in that moment. And I, and that right away I thought was, was really interesting and cool and very unique, very unique. So I'm curious how the film noir episode was discussed then, because it was really like a movie within a movie.

12:03 You couldn't sort of distinct, like that's, that one was especially meta. How did you guys discuss shooting that one? Even the, even the costuming was, was super specific. Yeah, I mean, the costume was just that idea of noir mixed with modern and that this was like because I've worked on shows before where they'll take an episode and it'll just feel like very different from the rest of it. You know, like they're trying to like I worked on Smilf years ago with Frankie Shaw and we did a Western like one of the episodes were just a Western same storyline. But what if it was a Western? What if it was Western? What if, yeah, what if we're on a horse instead of in a car?

12:46 And so that, I kind of thought about that for this. It's like, but it's full noir, you know? And, you know, a lot of the stuff that Seth was wearing is modern, but it's, you know, designed, you know, to look very... vintage and new irish and you know all the tones and textures we tried to to play in there i brought in a little uh a little like french new wave for him with his trench coat and his hat and even though people think it's more pink panther i'm like no that's really funny oh my gosh how funny yes i can see it i can see it well but that's seth you know that's yeah he's both that's the thing is he carries both of that yeah exactly exactly Yeah, and then- For Olivia Wilde, you know, I've seen her around.

13:37 I've met her briefly before, and she just has always had this cool kind of relaxed style to her. And so I wanted to incorporate that, but still make it feel a little vintage. So she's wearing modern, you know, kind of bootcut jeans and Converse high tops, but then she has this beautiful little 40s yellow Hawaiian top on. Right. Right, so subtle. Yeah, I bought that at the Pickwick Vintage Fair, like the weekend before. I was like, this is so cool. I think this would look great on her. And that's the shirt it became. And so, yeah, I just wanted to give a little.

14:18 There's also there's something about it, too, that reminded me of Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. Me too. When Brad Pitt was wearing kind of that yellow. Very much. Very much. There's a lot of little Easter eggs throughout the show. Yes. taken from our love of Hollywood and film. Yes. Either modern or period or as much as possible. That's what's so beautiful about this show is you've really glamorized Hollywood again, which is... everybody just sort of lost that love for Hollywood, you know, and we sort of like just disregard it and the streamer of it all, you know, and really like, I mean, like I was telling you, my son being like, I want to do this for a career, like who would have, it was so shocking to me that anybody would even admire Hollywood these days, but you brought that back.

15:13 Yeah. And where are you finding these outfits for Seth that are so like, I mean, I want them. I know. I think that they're very adrogynous. I think that, you know. Anybody could wear them. A lot of them we made. We custom made a lot of suits because he had this, you know, in the initial meeting, he's like, I don't think I, you know, this character should wear the same suit twice. You know, it should be very like, you know, like he needs to reek of money and just of like, you know. But it's still humble somehow. Is that what Seth does with it? Or, I mean, it's still somehow approachable.

15:55 It's just aspirational, but in a positive way. Well, I think also it's the way that the suits are structured and how he's able to kind of wear them. Like, he's very comfortable. He wears suits... you know, already outside. He incorporated that into his lifestyle of wearing these like very relaxed suits. And so it wasn't like, you know, just like throwing a suit on, you know, some people just be like, what do I do in this thing? But, you know, it's like soft shoulders and soft fabrics. Yeah. But, you know, there are things to it that are different than the way that he dresses normally. Like, you know, I wanted to make sure that the construction of everything was still, you know, the classic suiting.

16:38 You know, there's no elastics in there. There's no spandex or, you know, like none of that, like kind of a lot of the fabrics that are used today just for the more relaxed fit. Sure. Yeah. It was more in construction, the relaxing and then using nice linens and stuff. But we did order a lot. We ordered a lot of suits from Italy from some suit makers there that use a very nice linen. And then we would just change buttons or change just the shape maybe of the jacket, like take it in or do whatever we could to make it look the way that we wanted it to look.

17:19 Right. Catherine O'Hare is very like, the palette is just, is that something that you are doing? I know that you're a genius, so you're doing it on purpose, but what are you? And I've spoken about that. Yeah. I mean, because I felt like the character, I mean, know there was a lot of discussion of like how she would dress you know amy pascal obviously came up in conversation but it was like also what came into conversation with all these characters is it that we're not it's not just one person it's just this idea you know i like to call it like an essence in the wind of who this person is and and um And I felt like for her character, especially because there is this hierarchy of like, we have Bryan Cranston and then we have Catherine O'Hara Harris character.

18:16 And then we have Seth, you know, we have, we have, you know, Matt, and then we have Quinn that there's just like this trickle down of them, like looking up, like to what they aim to be right. Their end goal or, or whatever. And so for Catherine's character is like, she's Hollywood royalty at that point. Like she, you know, she is, has done it all she's been around you know she's the one that everybody wants to talk to not matt you know and and so i wanted to show her well within our palette because we had a very specific palette for the for continent continental and then each character had their very specific palette and her palette was like a lot of golds and bronzes and like these very like sophisticated, rich colors.

19:04 I kept thinking of past seasons of Max Mara, just this woman who is so in control, but so glamorous and also kind of sexy. The way that she pulls it all together and she's just fantastic, even though she lost her job. But if it is Amy Pascal or somebody in that position, that that she has this taste. And then we do see her when we first meet her, we see her in her home. And I was like, well, we need to match her home. Like this glamorous Hollywood lifestyle, even though she's a mess in that moment. It was so stunning the way you did that. And then she goes on from the first time you meet her, she goes on to just look like a sunset.

19:47 Like she just, it's like landscape. She looks like a whole. Yeah. There's a lot of like these like oranges. Yes. Yeah. Yes. That was specific. And that was very like, does this tone work? No, that tone, you know, like with all of them really, but like with her and with Matt's character. And then Catherine Han had more of like, she's still in that, that color palette, but it's more militant, you know, it's like more of the army greens and the browns, you know, like she's just, She comes in and she's a force. Everything's a little harder in the tone.

20:27 It's a little more military. Tell me about that collaboration because that's the question that my son had for you. He can't even look. It's like the Michael Scott of his world. He's just like, oh my God, I'm cringing so hard. Yeah. with her trying to do incorporate every trend and and how do you guys stay on top of it like that like how do you what do you see a trend on tiktok and implement it or uh i've never been on tiktok okay good um i know they're always like you know tiktok makeup and i'm like well i don't know what but um good yeah um Uh, you know, I mean, just working in this business, you see a lot of fads come and go and, and then you have a lot of friends that see those fads come and go and you see those fads come and go on them.

21:18 And that, you know, um, and it's, it's interesting because I think her and Seth's character are the ones that I get most of like, Oh, I know who you're thinking of for that. Or I've even had like women friends of mine that they're like, it's me isn't it and i'm like no i mean once again there's an essence of you yes it's a type there is you know this essence of this woman who um it's all or nothing you know and that's how she kind of lives her life and um but but a lot of those things that she's wearing are like that literally it you know came from popular brands and designs that some people can carry on.

22:05 I often go into places or look at designers and you know, think like how, who, your face is hilarious. I love how you're trying to process it. You look at it and you go, yes. Wow. Yeah. And like, I have two kids, uh, 27 and 19. And so there is this, like within that world, like I could see the 27 year olds wearing a cow slata or, you know, some of those things. And, um, or, um, what is that? Um, Jay, what is that? Um, Oh, it's going to Not Jay Laughlin. No, it's the suits from Jay Laughlin.

22:47 Yeah. No. Yeah. No, I'm thinking of a different, there's this door and this is one of them that I'll later I'll tell you what it was. Yeah. But just, you know, essence, if you go on essence website, you know, and there's just like, it's cool. It's really cool, but like who can pull it off some of this very kind of futuristic spacey, you know, looks and um i was like well how can what if what if this person is just somebody that wants you know like she thinks it's cool like she's out taking the temperature she she's on the streets right yeah because she's she's doing the publicity she knows what's happening yep so it's like she'll see something and then some stylist would bring it into her office like with her rocket clothes like this is really hot right now and then she just takes it and wears it you know um or she's like you know the other idea because there's nothing like it's just this amalgamation of so many experiences and ideas that kind of, you know, people process things.

23:53 And, and then, you know, I'm all about like the, the, the, the psychology of dressing and, you know, regional and all, you know, what region are you from? And what's the psychology behind it? And she could, you know, in my mind, she's somebody that grew up, you know, in the nineties, two thousands MTV, you know, you know, some JLo fly girl or like, you know, Gwen Stefani, you know, like these, these music videos that are so highly polished and, you know, stylized, like, but they're for the music video, but yeah, she's like incorporating it. Yeah. She's like, well, if JLo can do it or Beyonce can do it, I can do it.

24:34 You know, like at one point she's wearing a, these diesel jeans that are boots as well that have a million pockets. Like there's even like pockets on the ankle and it's, you know, it's cool. I think it's cool. When I saw them, I was like, those are so cool, but I wouldn't necessarily wear them, but like she did, you know, and the confidence. Yeah. With the confidence, complete commitment. And that, that is Catherine. Yeah. That is her, you know, bringing that confidence in there. Like if she can walk in those shoes, then yeah, she's going to walk in those shoes, you know, and she definitely could. And those fittings were so much fun.

25:14 I bet. She's just so game and funny. And I would love to see the things that you didn't pick. I know there are some that I was like, you know, like there, there are a few hats. Like I like, once again, I love a hat. You know, there's some furry, you know, crazy. There was a beanie, you know, but it's the way that you wear the beanie and it's squished to look like a nipple, you know, and you wear it right here. You see those people doing that? Absolutely. You know, well, once again, you got to, you know, Absolutely. You kind of slip in what you can and then appease if some things are too much.

25:56 But yeah, I do love a nipple beanie. I think they're hilarious. Let's make that happen. Yeah. I think that's in the future. Tell me about Quinn's garb and how you put that together. It's super cute. I just saw her in... in her other clothes in um i mean i'm sure they're not hers i mean oh i know what you did last summer yeah yeah i just saw her on that and and i was like oh my gosh this is like she's not in her outfits i was really didn't know what to do with that in for visual information i was like no i need quinn so tell me about those the clothing that you put on her in design you know you know she um you know, she, I talk about her character as being the one that like, I relate to the most, you know, like just like some of the, some of the things that she wears.

26:49 And, you know, she is, you know, she came in as the assistant to, to, Matt Remick. But she definitely has a drive to her. And when I was first talking to them about it, Frida, who it's loosely based on. Because when I first met Seth and I worked with him, Frida Perez was his assistant. And it was on Pam and Tommy. So she's the one I was always calling and talking to. And then cut to, you know, she's working at Point Crane. And then now she's, you know, one of the writer's producers on the studio. And, you know, I was just like, this is incredible. And so her character is like loosely based, you know, off of Frida.

27:34 And she was like, you know, she's kind of the, what's her name from... Seinfeld. Elaine. Elaine. Yeah. She's like, if you can think of her as kind of like the Elaine, like she's in with the boys, you know, but she still is like very specific. She's her own person. And, and, you know, I kind of took that, you know, Elaine had her very own unique style that a lot of people, you know, copied and, you know, it was like, oh, I'm in my Elaine look, you know, Seinfeld was like the white puppy sneakers and the jeans. And, you know, she had her very specific with her skirts and hair and stuff. And so for Quinn, you know, I just...

28:17 I love the idea of the suits. Like she's kind of mimicking Matt a bit. She's not like in a skirt. So she doesn't want to be seen as a secretary. She's not running around in little cute dresses or anything like that. Like she's there, you know, to work, like she means business and she wants them to, to respect her. And she's a beautiful woman, you know, and nothing you can do. It can take that away from her, but she kind of is a little more buttoned up. And, um, you know, there was like, I remember right before I did this field, uh, but right before I started prep on this, I watched this documentary on, um, sheer height who wrote, um, uh, the book.

29:04 Um, she wrote this, this feminist book in the seventies and she was like, kind of, uh, you know, it's a great documentary if you have a chance to watch it, but she just had, it was the way that she presented herself. She was always looked so beautiful and she had her very unique style and it was very kind of romantic. Mm-hmm. and sexy but like she was such a force of a person um but so elegant to i don't know there was something about it and when i first met with chase i was explaining it to her i was like it's not so much that we want to dress you like this woman it's it's more that idea of like she has a very unique style that she keeps like she doesn't She's not wavering.

29:53 She's not like Maya who's like, whatever is the latest fashion, I'm going to try. There's something about her that she kept in her life that she just kind of went towards. And it is. It's a lot of vintage Chanel, vintage Valentino. Um, you know, there's some vintage Gucci in there. There's just like this, but it's like, yeah, but it's like, it also, we were talking about that. She's kind of a Nepo baby. So maybe she could afford that. Yeah. Nice apartment. We saw the apartment in the show. Yeah. you know, even though she's not being taken so seriously yet, she knows that she has what it takes to do this.

30:35 And, and, um, it's not out of neat, you know, like monetary needs. It's more of like a drive that she has, like I'm going to conquer Hollywood. Yeah, absolutely. And, um, yeah, a lot of the suiting and, um, Um, I went through a period of time where I wore a lot of suits and ties and stuff. And some, some of the ties that she wears are from my own collection. There's this like really beautiful, like gold. It's, I call it a, a waistlet because it's like a bracelet, but it fits around your waist that she wears with all her high waisted flax. And, you know, just these like unique, subtle little things. She has this little like Panther necklace that she wears. Um, there's a lot of animal, like on her brooches and stuff.

31:18 Yes. I mean, I'm, I love a broach. I love a neckerchief, you know, but like every time I was like in the fitting rooms with her, I was like, Oh, you know, you're Sybil Shepard from taxi driver in this one. And, you know, or you're, you know, like we were just play, it was almost like playing dress up, but like, it just kind of like created this, this very unique character for her. And she really went with it. She loved wearing the glasses and these cute little heels and, Um, she's just like shuffling around the office, like, you know, and making her points and, um, And yeah, no, she, she was, I have a, like a, like a real soft spot for her character wardrobe.

32:03 It's just like, it's just so cute. I can definitely see the seeds being planted for what she's going to become as the season. Yeah. And that's, that's what we did with the last two seasons because it's like, there is a little bit of a time gap. Like then you see them and they're off to cinema con. And she does say like, You know, when they're on the plane, when you first see them, she's like, oh, I got a film greenlit. And, you know, she's stepping into this role. So now she's like her hair. She's like become somebody. And we put her in skirts for that because, you know, it's like a big weekend. And, you know, like she's her confidence, like she's not fighting anymore. Like she's now like kind of found her.

32:45 her groove a little bit. Yeah. The war episode, the war episode really put the characters in different places at the end, which was phenomenal writing. It's just so good. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Well, Cameron, I could talk to you about each of these characters all day and I probably will ask Kat to bring you back so we can talk about next season again. Oh yeah. Yeah. A lot more amazing things, but the work that you are doing on this is so fun to celebrate and just enjoy. And I just congratulate you on your nomination. It's so well-deserved. Thank you. I appreciate it. Thank you, Cameron.

33:27 Look Behind the Look is a Vinyl Foot production written by me, your host, Tiffany Bartok. Produced by Jace Bartok, edited by Mugresh Takor. If you're interested in learning more, find our video version on the YouTube channel, Look Behind the Look Podcast. There you can see rare photos and clips from our guests. And please follow us on Twitter at Look Behind Pod and Instagram at Look Behind the Look. If you like the show, please rate, review, and subscribe. And tell your friends and spread the word. You can subscribe to us on iTunes or any podcatcher of your choice. Thanks for listening to Look Behind the Look.